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Message: | composed: 16-10-2021 19:37 Go to the top of this page Zum Ende der Seite springen
Ralph Dragon Ralph Dragon is a male



Titan of Ether
Member since: 19-09-2021
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quote:
Originally posted by Sir Iceblade
Well, a lot of these features I am not new to as the Wing Commander CIC forums have already made the same enhancments some time ago--on a php board no less. Kind of amazing how they have managed to avoid be spammed to death (especially with all the search bots on their).

Anyway, it will be an easy transition. The only thing I don't like is it feels very calustrophopic, very constricted on the boards. Width of the important stuff is too short.

Other than that, it looks pretty cool. Big Grin


Were they as popular as we are, though? Big Grin Cool Pleased


Ralph Dragon
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Message: | composed: 16-10-2021 19:50 Go to the top of this page Zum Ende der Seite springen
Ralph Dragon Ralph Dragon is a male



Titan of Ether
Member since: 19-09-2021
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Favourite Ultima: Ultima 7 Serpent Isle

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quote:
Originally posted by -Direhaggis-
Ultima 6 was an exceptional game itself--in a few ways arguably better than Ultima 7, I think. Certainly the dungeons were more interesting to me and seemed to be much larger.

That and, to this day, nothing really beats the intro and choosing your class sequences--although the original Arena was pretty cool in that regard.


For me it's different. I love Ultima 6, after all it was my very first Ultima and very first real PC game ever! But truth be told, it was limited and had downsides that I saw were fixed and improved upon in Ultima 7.

The interface for one thing. In U6, you barely had 1/4 of the screen for gameplay, and it got worse at night since your visibility was cut in half, so you could only see maybe with 1/8 of the screen. Using a torch helped, but the interface was still very clogged up. U7 on the other hand, had no such interface to get in your way. It was beautiful, you could see everything and interact with everything, even through walls Tongue .

Graphics wise, there's no comparison between U6's boring graphics and U7 beautiful crafted and detailed VGA graphics, objects, portraits, etc. The same goes for the sound, which was much better in U7.

Story-wise, U7's was more engrossing than U6. I won't say more, because I'm still working on something. Wink But I will say that U6 promised things in the story and didn't deliver on everything, which even U9 delivered on instead for crying out loud!!


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Message: | composed: 16-10-2021 20:20 Go to the top of this page Zum Ende der Seite springen
Xelasarg

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quote:
Graphics wise, there's no comparison between U6's boring graphics and U7 beautiful crafted and detailed VGA graphics, objects, portraits, etc. The same goes for the sound, which was much better in U7

Well, that was simply a matter of technical improvements that were (and are still being) made through the years. U6 was developed for 80286/VGA machines at the most (2000 $ back thenBig Grin ), yet it still had to run on XTs w/ CGA/Hercules graphics.
And, speaking of boring graphics, you would better compare U6 to U5, where the difference is much greater.
Of course you're right, U7 did everything better than U6, but U6 was the first RPG ever that gave you the freedom to manipulate and interact with the world (e.g. taking and moving chairs, crates, etc., or blowing up doors), which makes it the most significant Ultima IMHO.


The denizens of this mystic place assault you without warning.
You see 99 Berserkers, 99 Berserkers, 99 Berserkers, and 99 Berserkers.

Will your stalwart band choose to (F)ight or (R)un?
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Message: | composed: 17-10-2021 02:27 Go to the top of this page Zum Ende der Seite springen
Sir Iceblade Sir Iceblade is a male

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Actually the CIC is the primary place to go for Wing commander news and its forum is the primary WC forum. Never any indications whether the features were liked or not (nobody complained though).
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Message: | composed: 17-10-2021 09:34 Go to the top of this page Zum Ende der Seite springen
Thepal Thepal is a male

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I'm gonna jump on the U6 bandwagon. I usually rank U6 above U7 simply because of the story/gameplay. U6 is the only game I know of that is like... completely non-linear. You can go straight to the end and finish it if you want, or you can go along an extremely long main plot (which you can also do a variety of ways).

Add to that the huge dungeons, which meet up with each other. The dozens of non-plot related things in the world. The game just gave you so much freedom. U7 doesn't even come close to it in that respect. No other game does.


-==Thepal==-

"We have nothing to do with the mass of men, we two. We walk across the many worlds; by our actions, entire nations crash down or are saved from death." - Mors Gotha
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Message: | composed: 17-10-2021 17:47 Go to the top of this page Zum Ende der Seite springen
Sir Iceblade Sir Iceblade is a male

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Sounds a bit like oblivion (go straight through the main story or start the story then spend five months to a year game time before finishing the story.

This gender sign seems kind of usually on this board (I have not seen one yet that is female).

This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Sir Iceblade: 17-10-2021 17:49.

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Message: | composed: 17-10-2021 18:17 Go to the top of this page Zum Ende der Seite springen
Ralph Dragon Ralph Dragon is a male



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In all honesty Thepal, U6's open-endedness doesn't come close to the Elder Scrolls games, espcecially after I played one for the first time (Morrowind).

But U6's open gameplay is really due to weak mechanics, planning, and bugs. Heck, I even commonly encountered a bug in U6 that was called bug that resulted in me getting the message bug! repeated indefinitely, until, that is, I reset the game.

You made the point already, in U6 you can go straight to the end and finish it, which is what I did even without any cheats. I can finish the game in an hour, or less, if I wanted to, but the game ends and you didn't go through the main steps altogether.

That means the story and quests were broken and not open ended. When something is "open-ended" it means you can approach it from any which time and in any which way, by definition. In U6's case, you can skip to the end(s) without doing anything. Open-ended would be that you could ask for an permission, or force it out of that person, but when you can get through a barrier due to a bug and skip that whole open-ended path, then it's broke.

The thing for me is that I love U6, so nobody get the wrong impression here. I'm being tough out of love. But the truth is that U6 had it's issues and holes, and the things that it did well, were done far better in U7. I think for me that U6 gave the impression of openness more that it actually fulfilled and provided as such.


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This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Ralph Dragon: 17-10-2021 18:18.

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Message: | composed: 17-10-2021 22:19 Go to the top of this page Zum Ende der Seite springen
Thepal Thepal is a male

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Sir Iceblade, you seem to misunderstand. I don't mean like Oblivion. I mean that you can do pretty much anything in the main quest at any time. For example, there's a treasure you're meant to find. At any time you could dig it up (which means you could theoretically find it by accident). You can go to the Gargoyle world (which is probably meant to happen further towards the end of the game) as soon as you start. Things don't happen only after you do other things. You can do almost anything at any time. Hence, non-linearity.

And Ralph, that's why I like it. I don't consider it to be broken. If the Avatar was to test the orb of the moons (as British tells you to) and end up in the gargoyle city, run into the mountains to escape the gargoyles and find Beh Lem straight away, is that so unbelievable? (that's what happened to me the first time)

If you want to use the hot-air balloon to get over the mountains rather than get a sacred mission to get passed the pillars, then why not? You can search the world for the treasure map, but it's not really necessary, so if you find another way then that's fine too.

I don't like when the main quest is only moved on by you doing the thing proceding it. Following out a linear story that the designer created. Black Gate was a lot like U6 in that you could do almost anything at any time, but I still think U6 did it better. (Serpent Isle is obviously extremely linear)


-==Thepal==-

"We have nothing to do with the mass of men, we two. We walk across the many worlds; by our actions, entire nations crash down or are saved from death." - Mors Gotha
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Message: | composed: 18-10-2021 00:24 Go to the top of this page Zum Ende der Seite springen
Ralph Dragon Ralph Dragon is a male



Titan of Ether
Member since: 19-09-2021
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Favourite Ultima: Ultima 7 Serpent Isle

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Wow, you know Thepal, the very same thing happened to me in U6 and I ended up in between the Gargoyles and I was shocked and confused to say the least. (This might have had something to do with the fact that every now and then I would just wander aimlessly at full speed, running, or on a mount, in any direction.

Hell, I found the treasure from my first try at digging. It helped that I'm a genius of course.

But actually, I wasn't referring to the hole in the mountains, around the Codex temple unless I'm mistaken (forgotten), but instead I meant that using the balloon very early on in the game, I could go through the force field at the gates to the codex temple and I wasn't supposed to be able to do that technically and in the story. That's what mean bu broken .... hey wait a second, I wrote that example about the balloon but I deleted it before I posted my message... how did you know about that... how very suspicious!!?? Wink


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Message: | composed: 18-10-2021 09:03 Go to the top of this page Zum Ende der Seite springen
Thepal Thepal is a male

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Nah. I don't call that broken. I like to think that anything you can do in a game should be considered valid (not including things that are obviously bugs, such as something that will duplicate items or something). That of course means the people making the game need to make things foolproof against things like that.

With my Ultima remake I'm trying to let players do that wherever possible. Letting them do whatever they want to tackle various situations. Like... um... Let's say there's an army that is getting ready to attack someone. You could help get them supplies so they can leave earlier. Or you could destroy a supply warehouse so they can't leave for longer. Or you could go in the supply warehouse and eat every bit of food, which would have much the same effect. Or you could kill the leader and delay them, or the new leader might decide to attack straight away (so they might kill him too). Or you could spy on them and give the people they're attacking intel. Or you could fight with them. Or you could kill half the army and then they can't attack anyone. Or you could just ignore the situation completely and do something else.

Checking for every possible thing the player can do is kinda... complex. And insane. But still, I think that's what makes a great game. Letting the player play as they want, get around situations if they want, skip a step if it makes sense, etc. If the player finds the Amulet of Amazing Mystical Power (tm) without being told where it is first, then so be it. I don't see that as breaking the main quest. I see that as just doing things a different way.


-==Thepal==-

"We have nothing to do with the mass of men, we two. We walk across the many worlds; by our actions, entire nations crash down or are saved from death." - Mors Gotha
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